Kati Ellis, a wife, mom to four and photographer, firmly believes in record keeping. In episode 99, Kati discusses how record keeping has helped her to come closer to Christ and bond with her children. She shares how her own mother’s record of a tragic accident Kati experienced as a child helped her heal. Kati gives tips and resources she has created to help others start documenting in their own families. At the end, Kati relates the beautiful way God taught her about being His partner in motherhood. Kati is a light and you don’t want to miss hearing her story.
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Darla: [00:01:20] Welcome to the Spiritual Minded Mom podcast. I am so excited that you are here today. I have a great guest. Her name is Katie Ellis, and she is married to her best friend and she doesn’t even care if that sounds cheesy. She has four littles at home who run the show and have become her favorite subjects for creativity.
She has a degree in photography and has traveled quite a bit working as a documentary photographer. And she is passionate about recording life because in the light reflected off her subjects, she sees Jesus. Kati is the cofounder of the Faith Collective, where she helps women tell their stories of faith and helping others record spiritual memories has been one of the greatest experiences of her life.
She recently started a new account to help others learn the art of record making. It’s been a really wild ride for her spiritually, but she says that she is just trying to follow God’s promptings step-by-step. So, Kati, I’m so excited that you’re here today.
Thank you for being here.
Kati: [00:02:14] Absolutely. I’m very humbled, very humbled to be here.
Darla: [00:02:17] Well, this is going to be great. I am really excited to dive in. If anyone can’t tell from your bio, you love record keeping. You’re a photographer. You like to write; you like to help share other people’s stories in lots of different ways.
And so, I’m excited to talk to you about that today. I think all the things that you’re doing are just fantastic. But, one of the things that you told me when we were prepping for the interview was that you feel like record keeping is a tool for recognizing the Savior in your family’s life.
And I think that is beautiful, but I would love to hear, how did you discover that? And what does that look like in your family’s life?
Yes. Well, I think. So, I mean, I guess I should start by saying that there’s lots of different ways to keep records. You know, from journal writing to, for me, photography is probably my main, my main tool for record keeping. There’s also, you know, videography and even just doing little family podcasts where you record your family’s voices and stuff.
But I think, when I was in college, I had a professor who said to me, you know, you’ve got a 360-degree view of the world around you and you chose this image. Why did you put these things in your frame? And I think I had some kind of like artsy response to it about, “Oh, you know, I see beauty in the mundane,” or whatever.
I didn’t really know, but I, but I did know that I felt like it was important what I had photographed, but I didn’t really know. And as I’ve grown in my photography, but also in my relationship with the Savior, I have learned that, the reason that I put things in my frame is because that’s where I see the Savior.
And I think that that hit me the strongest as I was dealing with some postpartum and just really having a hard time being the mom that I wanted to be with all of the exhaustion and some chronic pain I was dealing with. And so, I kept just grabbing my camera, enough that my children would comment about how I just always have the camera around my neck.
And I always joke that they think that my head looks like a big black lens because that’s the only thing they see from me. And it is true except for that I realized that through a lot of prayer, honestly, the spirit told me that the reason why I go to that camera is because when you are recording, when you’re photographing something, what you’re actually photographing is light being reflected off of your subject, you know, recording the subject.
Kati: [00:04:30] And as it says in the scriptures, the Savior is the light of the world. And as I’m recording my family, I am recording the light or the Savior that is within them. And so that became my why. Why do I record? Because that’s how I see Jesus. And as I recorded more and more, I’ve been able to really kind of narrow down where and how we can hear and see Him in our life and then give that record to my children so that they can see the Savior in their lives and in them, in their little moments. Even in their tear moments, the light that comes off of those little tears is a way of teaching them that the Savior is there, even in the hard times.
Darla: [00:05:07] Yeah, I love that. So, so you’re, you’re doing this for yourself so that you can see the Savior through them and through the things that you’re photographing and recording, and then you have a record to give to them, to show them as their mother this is what I see, and everything is pointing us to the Savior.
So, I think you have a really great story that I want you to share about how that happened for you through your own mother. And so, will you, will you share that story?
Yes. Yes, I do. Okay. So, when I was two, my nose was bit off by a dog. Like all the way off, completely off. I had a hole in my face and there was no nose.
And, I, you know, obviously I don’t really remember it because I was two years old, but over the years I’ve been told by all of my family, it was a family reunion that we were there for. And, everybody has a part that they remember about the event. Funny things. They found my nose by stepping on. It all sorts of things.
But after saying a prayer and you know, and, different things about like how miraculous it was that we were able to find a doctor close enough to help us preserve my nose because, and this I’m sorry, if this is graphic and gross,
We’re laughing. I mean, it’s tragic, but it is kind of funny when you say my nose got bit off by a dog.
Kati: [00:06:26] It’s very funny. And you know, I imagined, well, I know that from my parents, it was very traumatic, but I have a nose, you know, and it’s there and it’s fine. It’s got a scar. But, anyway, I heard the story multiple times from different people and even what happened after and how they had to like all the therapy and all of the people who would come and watch over me at night so that I wouldn’t touch my nose so that the nose could reattach, and there’s lots of beautiful moments, but that story always kind of defined me because I had a scar on my nose for a long time. I had to wear like pink zinc on my nose, or it didn’t have to be pink. I guess I chose pink, but on my nose in order to protect it from the sun and you know, it just kind of defined me.
And then years and years later, I kind of asked my mom something about it and we found this little mask that she had sewn that I had to wear to protect my nose. And so, we got talking about it and I asked her if she had written anything down and my mom’s not really a record keeper, though I’m going to get her there.
But she did write one thing down. She really did, and it changed my life. So, she sends me this, just like these pages. She took pictures of them that she had written after, right after the event. And it was, incredibly incredibly powerful and life changing for me as I read through her raw emotions.
And I read about my dad’s like grief over the whole situation. And as I read really the like actual miracles that happened, and as I read about all the people who are like woven in and out of my life in order to help heal my nose and, while, it is just a nose, I suddenly felt like I wasn’t defined by the scar on my nose. I was defined by how much care my family had for me. I’m going to get emotional. How much care my, my parents had for me, for my extended family had for me. And then most importantly, how much care my Savior had for me and how He was with my mom and with my dad and with all the people around me and with me and how much God loved me in my little two year old self .I’d never done anything noteworthy in the world at all at that point, but I was already important enough for all of those incredible miracles and all those incredible people to just rally and love. And I think when I read that, it just, just like this spiritual whammy kind of, you know, that just like, “Listen, your life matters, you matter, and you’re connected to incredible people who came before you, and you’re connected to incredible little people who are going to come after.” And when we record those things, we don’t know the impact that it’s going to have. My mom had no idea. I’m sure when she wrote it, I’m sure it was just because like, this is a big moment. I gotta write it down. And I think also some therapy for her to write it down to kind of process what was going on as I was going in and out of the hospital, and all of that. I don’t think she had any idea that like it was going to redefine my life and confirm to me how rooted in the Savior I really, really am and how rooted our family is and where we come from and where I want my children to head and what I want them to know. And the cool thing is it’s such a ripple effect, right? Because that was so impactful for me, that I immediately was like, I need to be better even at recording my spiritual moments for my children, and then they can move back, and they can feel that.
And then it’ll just keep going and going. And we have a family culture that’s rooted deeply in our Savior.
Darla: [00:09:47] I love that. And if any mom listening has been struggling to record something, that should be a good motivation. Do it. What a great blessing in your life that your mom did that and she didn’t even know, like, you might think that you’re writing down something that’s just mundane, that doesn’t matter, but it will matter to someone else or it might matter to you.
I know I’ve seen in my life where I’ve written something and didn’t think anything of it and then have gone back and read it at another time. I can see God everywhere, you know, woven in my life because I wrote it down. So, it’s so important. So, I really, I really love that story and how it illustrates the impact a mother can have by recording something on her children.
So how have you seen recordkeeping play out in your life as a mother and how has it affected your own kids?
Kati: [00:10:37] So, I would say one of the coolest or biggest testimony builders of why it’s so important to record happened to me a couple of years ago. My son is, when he was six at the time, he has some like, really crazy natural talent for the bow staff, which is a weapon in martial arts, and he loves it and he had really wanted to do this tournament. And I, and I was like, “Sure, buddy, if you practice every single day, and you work really hard. I’ll take you to that tournament.” And he did he practice every day.
So, I was like really impressed that he is. So, I was like, alright, here we go. We’re going. So he drove up to the tournament and on the way there, he said, “Hey, if I qualify for this, big, like regional it’s called district a tournament that covers Arizona, it covers a bunch of states, if I qualify, can we go?”
And I was like, “Sure, buddy,” knowing he had to win the tournament to go. And so, I just didn’t expect what happened. And we ended up having to go to this tournament and it was a six-hour drive away and I was a gymnast growing up. And, competition was like the hardest part about gymnastics for me. I have like a little bit of PTSD. I think kind of from being in front of people.
I really struggled with that. And so, I didn’t realize that with my own children, it was going to be that much worse, so much worse. And it’s not because I wanted him to win some martial arts tournament, but mostly because I just wanted him to feel the pride of working really hard and feel the success that he put into, and also not feel the disappointment because I’m a mom and it’s hard, you know, anyway, we were driving there and I was a disaster.
I mean, my husband was like, you’ve got to pull yourself together. I was so nervous, so nervous, I couldn’t think straight. And he was starting to get nervous maybe because of me, probably because of me, but also just because this is a big thing he was about to do, and thousands and thousands of people were going to be watching him.
And I was like, well, I can’t mother him. I can’t mother him. I can’t even be there for him. He needs me to be in his corner and I’m in my own corner, in a ball, just full of anxiety. So, I whipped out my journal and was like, here we go. I couldn’t photograph really; we were in my car. So, I whipped out my journal and I just started praying and just writing my prayer, just like the most heartfelt prayer I could think of. And I do that practice a lot. I love to write my prayers because it slows me down. And then I can hear the Savior, or I can hear Heavenly Father speaking to me a lot better that way. And I can record my impressions on the opposite page. And so, I just started writing and writing and writing, and it was like six hours of writing. But as we got to the tournament, I closed up my journal with a promise that I would always remember this moment and share it for others who could help me with the exact words that I needed to say to my son in the moment of his competition and with total peace in my heart and in my mind that everything was going to be great.
And, we walked in. It was a two-day tournament and it was just so overwhelming. And I walked in and I saw him go from super excited to all of a sudden, what am I doing here? And I knelt down next to him. And I was able to say those words. I saw just this peace and the calm come over him. I felt peace and calm.
And we finished the tournament. But I think the thing that I love so much about that moment is that I was able to use record keeping to recover, to heal in my own parenting. I was able to then show my son that said the savior is right there with him. That God loves him and it’s okay. And we’re going to do great and everything’s going to be fine.
And I was able to like, bring him back to all of the chaos, all the hard work and remember what is really important. What is really important in this moment. And what we need to focus on. And then, have this beautiful record of my prayer. So that later, when he goes back, he’s got a son who’s struggling or, or even as he’s wondering why he’s, you know, why he was brought to our family or where he wants to go in life. He’s got this beautiful record of how much his mom loves him and how much God loved him and how much the Savior was right there in his life in a six year old moment of martial arts, you know, so I think that that’s probably. That moment, right there just has always stuck with me and I promised Heavenly Father that I would always try to help others see the value of record keeping and always remember it myself and always remind myself that this is a tool that you can use to come closer to the Savior.
Darla: [00:14:52] I love that. I love that the record keeping is a way for you. To teach your child about God’s love for them. I mean, that, that is the greatest reason. I mean, we all want our kids to know that God is there and that he loves them. And, and to know how to come to the Savior and recordkeeping is a great way to do that.
And that’s probably the greatest benefit and the greatest reason why we should do it. But are there other things that you’ve seen in your life besides the great spiritual benefits? What are the other things that you’ve seen that have impacted your children through your own record keeping?
Kati: [00:15:28] Well, I just, the other day, my son walked over and picked up one of our little books of photographs and words that I had written down and he was reading it and he’s like, “Hey mom, remember this moment?” But he doesn’t remember that moment because he was too young to remember that moment.
But it’s a memory in his mind. And so, he remembered that moment. It was a beautiful moment of love, you know, or my little, my little girl, she talks about this moment with her, with her great grandma all the time that she cannot possibly remember, but it’s huge in black and white on my wall. I’ve, written blessings down that I’ve been given that have talked about record keeping and the impact that have on my children.
So I think that there’s a lot of different ways, but one time I was listening to a conference about the things that we put on the walls teach our children, the things that are the most important to us. And I always, I just, I don’t actually know to be honest if that’s what they were teaching, but that’s what I learned from it.
And so, I found that my kids feel very connected to their Savior, but also to their family. They feel like they have memories and they feel like they understand and know these people that they wouldn’t necessarily have but because it’s been recorded and it’s, I mean, I have a full gallery wall kind of thing. And it’s not fancy. I mean, we’re talking Ikea frames and Costco photograph friends because like who can afford other things. but my kids can remember those things and they look them, and it helps them feel really connected. And it helps them know who they are, where they come from, which I honestly feel like if there’s anything that I can teach my kids, really, it’s that they are children of God.
And that they’ve come to a family who loves them unconditionally and that together we’re going to make it back. We’re going to be able to be with our Heavenly Father and our Savior again, but we’re going to do it together and we’re going to do it with our past ancestors and we’re going to do it with all the people come.
And we’re just playing our role on earth right now by helping record and testifying that the great things God has done in our lives.
Darla: [00:17:20] I read recently, about this study that a psychologist did that children hearing the stories of their family and knowing them builds resilience and helps them to, to say, “Oh, if, if someone in my family did something hard, oh, I can do something hard too. Or, you know, it helps them to get through it.
And it’s a great, what you’re doing is a great way to, to teach them that and to show them through those photographs. And then that prompts stories. I love that your child feels like they know their great grandma. And they couldn’t possibly, but they feel like they know because you took the time to record those moments.
What have you learned about record keeping in the scriptures?
Kati: [00:17:59] Well, you know, I feel like keeping records in our life is really just emulating exactly what the scriptures are. If you open up the Book of Mormon, First Nephi chapter one, he says we’ve experienced really great things in our lives and really hard things. Therefore, I write the things. I write this record, right? And the, the introduction to the Book of Mormon talks about how the part of the purpose of the book of Mormon is to show the great things the Lord has done for our fathers. So, I feel like if you read throughout the scriptures there’s countless situations of prophets not really knowing necessarily why they’re writing things down, but they were writing it down and I’m talking to their children about how important it is that they’re passing on this record.
Then there’s stories, you know, as Nephi is trying to talk to his brothers and saying like, Hey, you know, we’ve got to do this. And I have faith that we can do this. Look at this record, look back from where we came from. If Moses can part the Red Sea, we can build this boat. You know, there’s countless times in the scriptures that show us how critical records are in keeping us connected to God.
You know, I love that the first thing that was recorded in Doctrine and Covenants 29 from the Savior to the organized church was let there be a record among you. It’s important. It is really important. And, and I think that sometimes when you hear how important it is, that feels overwhelming. Like, Oh, I hadn’t been writing in my journal. I’m not a journal writer, you know, or I take pictures on my phone and they get lost forever. And my videos, I don’t know where they are on the cloud. It feels really overwhelming, but we’re not talking a regular journal writer, though you should be, and it will benefit your life greatly. That’s not what we’re talking about here.
My mom wrote one thing down and it changed my life. Start with just recording one thing about the great things that the Lord has done in your life, and it will have massive impacts on you, your children and your posterity.
Darla: [00:19:47] I love that. That was actually going to be my next question. You kind of answered it.
Like where does the mom start? Like what would you say to a mom? Okay. She’s hearing this. She feels inspired by what you’ve shared. Where should she start? She’s done nothing. Or she doesn’t feel like she’s done anything. Where should she start with the recordkeeping so that her children can see the goodness of Jesus in their life?
Kati: [00:20:08] Yeah. So, I would say first, take a deep breath and say a prayer. Always. Always take a deep breath and say a prayer. No use wasting your time trying to record a bunch of stuff that comes from you. Say a prayer and Heavenly Father will help me know what’s the most important thing to record. And then I would say that if you haven’t done anything at all, just do one thing, right? Just write down one thing. Elder Anderson talked about recording spiritually defining moments in this last general conference and how important that is. And if all you do is record one spiritually defining moment, that’ll make a difference.
But I would also say that there are lots of ways to get kind of a good grasp on, what you want to record and what your family culture is. And that is oftentimes by journal prompts or doing different photo experiments and stuff, and just kind of going by the spirit and deciding what you want to photograph.
I have created two different downloads that are totally for free, that would really help when you’re starting.
Darla: [00:21:04] Yeah. Share those. That’d be great.
Kati: [00:21:06] Okay. I didn’t know if you wanted me to share it.
Darla: [00:21:08] So yeah, totally, totally.
Kati: [00:21:10] Okay. So, if you go to the Faith Collective Instagram, and you go to the link in the bio, or just the website and you sign up for the newsletter, there is a download that you get and it’s totally free.
And that download will walk you through how to record a spiritual defining moment. And I have been recording spiritual, defining moments my whole life. And when I did this download and then like after I created it, and then I went back, and I did it myself. I was like, oh, this is the game changer. It takes out all of the worry and all the stress because you’re literally just saying a prayer going by the spirit and answering these questions.
And when I was done, I had this beautiful story of faith, beautiful story of faith about it was about my son’s birth. And I felt I’ve been trying to write that for months. And it was just too overwhelming for me. But to just be able to break it down so easy. So, I would say, start with that for your own story of faith.
The second thing is that I started this new Instagram account and I mean, like it’s super tiny and I barely just started it and I’m just trying to follow the Spirit. And I thought it was starting it for something totally different. And as soon as I started going, I just felt this like push in a totally different direction to help people, do this exact thing.
There is a download there. It’s called The Art of Record Making, and it’s free and you download it and it’ll walk you through how to record your family’s culture more than just like writing one spiritually defining moment, but how to take your photographs and connect it with a journal entry and how to keep it all connected, so you’re not losing video and how to be more intentional about recording so that instead of just showing up at your kid’s birthday party and either be like, “Oh no, I forgot to record this important milestone in their life,” or feeling like “I didn’t even get to experience it because all I was doing was snapping pictures.”
And you’re intentional about it. So, before the birthday party comes, there’s a little worksheet on there you fill out. It takes five minutes and you write down why this party in their life is important. It also kind of helps you focus more on the big picture not maybe so much that they were like a Ninja for Halloween, or they really wanted a PJ Masks birthday party, but more who they are as a person turning this age and the impact they’ve had on your life and your family’s life. So, you answer that and then suddenly you have like a really intentional and impactful way to record their birthday. You write a list and it helps walks you through maybe three or four photographs that need to be taken in order to record that birthday party with that journal entry. You take those at the beginning or when they happen. You put your phone down; you’re totally engaged, totally present for such a beautiful moment, but you also have a really real record of what actually mattered on that day. So, I would say start with those two things because I think you don’t have to know anything.
You don’t have to be good at photography. You don’t have to be a good journal writer. There’s tips in there–three tips for photography, three tips for recording with journaling, three tips for video, and three tips for audio and like a little bonus thing in there that will help you just get started, but you don’t have to have any sort of talent or any sort of skill.
You just have to. Just have to do it. You just have to like to dig in and do it. And it saves you time in the long run to do it upfront, intentionally. Otherwise I get lots of questions. I feel like I have 1 million pictures on my iPad. How do I put it together? I’m like, I don’t know. That’s a lot. You have to go through it.
That’s just a lot of time. You have to go through it. There might be some apps out there, but really you just have to go through your pictures. But if you think about it upfront, then you’ve taken four pictures that are treasured instead of 400 pictures that you have to, like, this is the same, this is the same, you know?
Darla: [00:24:24] That’s for me. Since I’ve met you, I have tried to be more intentional about recording like everyday things. I’m not a great photographer. I’m not really good. I mean, I’m the mom that’s like, oh, the birthday party is over, and I forgot to take a picture.
Kati: That’s good. You were present. That’s great.
But I was there, but, but I have been trying to document, like being in this situation where we’ve been home a lot and I’ve been with my family. I have teenagers and they don’t like to stop and take a photo, but I’ve been going around, Hey, I want to document this.
And they’re like, are you going to post it? I’m like, no, I’m not going to post it. I just want to document our family during this time. And I’ve been trying to do that. And so, so they’re getting better, but I love the one thing that I love. I love all of it, but like the one thing that really stood out to me, it was intention.
Like that one word can change everything about how you document, and it can save you time. I mean, if I would just have an intention before that birthday party, then I wouldn’t forget to take the picture and have nothing, you know, to remember it by. I love that what you offer is just helping us have intention.
Kati: [00:25:31] Oh, a hundred percent.
Darla: [00:25:32] That is like a great first step, right?
Kati: [00:25:34] Yes. That is that. And the little, the little worksheet that comes in there is all about, you know, it helps you think through what your intention really even is. And the birthday party is like a really easy and simple example of something, but, you know, this quarantine time in our life, that’s a big thing. And I think sometimes people might feel a little overwhelmed like what do we document? And I’ve watched as people have documented stuff and some people are taking the approach like these are all of the things that we’ve done as we’ve been together. And some people are taking other approaches, but I think when you can be intentional about it, then, then you can record the whole picture. And I think that that’s one of the biggest lessons that I’ve learned is that I’m never going to be a perfect mom and I’m never going to record everything perfectly.
I’m never going to get every single thing, but I’m not expected to be perfect. I am expected to be perfected in Christ. And, what that means is that I am whole in him and that’s the whole picture. That’s the good stuff and the hard stuff. That’s the moments where we’re in the valleys and also the moments as we’re climbing the mountain.
And also, our victories are big, big victories. So, birthday parties are incredibly important to record, but so are the mundane things that are important to record. So are the tears. So are the really big, victories where your family can celebrate together memories that you’ll, you know, you’ll put on your wall forever.
And I think that that’s the biggest thing is that we’ll never be perfect, but we can be intentional, and we can be prayerfully intentional. I think that. I think that when you first ask God, “What is important here?” Not only does it help you record what’s important, but it also helps you focus on what’s important.
I don’t know, birthday parties are overwhelming to me and I feel like I’m losing my mind to the whole time. But if I’m intentional beforehand about what’s important, then I’ve seen the Savior in my tiny birthday party. And I am seeing God love on my babies better than I could possibly love on them. And I feel that love straight through me to them, you know?
Darla: [00:27:27] Yeah, I love that prayerful intention. Like there you go. That’s what you need to start. That’s so good.
So, Katie, this has been wonderful and I’m so grateful that you have some resources that you have developed this talent in your life to be able to share it with other people. And I’m happy I can help share those.
So, I will link all those up in the show notes and we will share those. So, thank you so much, but I do have one final question for you. And that is how have you seen them felt your heavenly parents as your partners in motherhood?
Kati: [00:27:56] Ooh. Can I share it through a story?
Darla: [00:27:58] Yes, absolutely.
Kati: [00:28:00] Okay. This just happened to me recently and obviously there’ve been other moments in my life, but I think that this one was really impactful because this one, I think, relates to a lot of moms.
My fourth baby is not a great sleeper, like really not a great sleeper. And I’ve had a hard time with that this time around. And there was a night where he was up and I had been, I tried everything to put him down, tried everything and just couldn’t get him down. I finally laid him down and he was kind of asleep and I laid in bed and I could hear him start to fuss.
And I just like, I couldn’t get back up again. And I just said a prayer and I said, please just Heavenly Father, just do this for me. Just put him to sleep. And then I heard him cry a little bit more and I was like, please do this for me. I mean, just begging, like, please, I just need you to do this for me. And then all of a sudden, I heard him crying.
I’m feeling all overwhelmed and stressed. And then I hear clear as day the exact same words back to me, “Do this for me.” And, instead of feeling overwhelm and exhaustion, I felt sudden peace, sudden clarity and sudden motivation to be like, I’m doing this for my Heavenly Father. And then just like, “Hold him for me. Love him for me. Be there with him for me.”
And I think, I will never forget those words, “Do this for me” in my mind. When parenting gets hard, when I feel overwhelmed, when I don’t know how to answer my kids’ questions, when I’m worried about their future, “Do this for me.” Do this for Him. That’s how we parent together. I am his arms to hug his babies. I imagine he wants to be there for them. And I am his hands literally to hug them, to hold them, to comfort them. And my parenting is now for the Savior. It changes the way that I think about my children and also the way that I respond to things. I feel my Heavenly Parents, both my Heavenly Father and my Heavenly Mother asking me to mother for them.
Just that mindset I think has helped me have confidence in the way that I mother them and has helped me change from frustration, upset, confusion, anxiety to confidence in the Spirit. So, I would say that that’s probably the best way I can describe how I parent with Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother.
Darla: [00:30:11] What a defining moment in your motherhood to realize that and how that changes everything.
Kati: [00:30:16] Absolutely.
Darla: [00:30:17] Do it for Him. Do it for Him. That’s so beautiful. Kati, I have loved talking to you and thank you so much for coming on and sharing your love for the Savior and your love for motherhood and for documenting so that our children will know where to look. I think it’s beautiful. Thank you so much.
Kati: [00:30:34] Well, thank you for having me. I love this podcast and I love you. And I’ve been so inspired by all of the beautiful voices that have been heard through you. So, I’m really grateful to be here.
Darla: [00:30:43] Thank you.